Banned for ‘Internet Slapfight’ despite the vast majority of my comments being to debunk Hasbara, and disengaging from a Zionist troll when the attacks went from disinformation to personal
Post:
https://lemmy.world/post/30244778
Luckily none of my comments pertaining to the actual issue at hand got deleted, but how this somehow warrants a ban is completely ridiculous.
I do want to promote some better World News comms:
!altmedia@altmedia.house Avoid due to their support of white Nationalist propagandist Tucker Carlson. See https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/comment/19034187
For obvious reasons I won’t be engaging with the lw world news, nor be able to debunk any hasbara there that aims to justify this genocide one way or another
PTB, yes, but you don’t get any points from me for recommending a pro-Tucker Carlson community.
This community is ‘AltMedia’ in the Mearshiemer and Walt sense. Not the Richard Spencer sense.
We like […] Tucker Carlson
Yeah, okay.
I didn’t catch that either, that list of names didn’t include Tucker Carlson when I first subbed. That is unacceptable, white nationalists should not be tolerated
I’m crossing that community out
@AltMediaGuy@altmedia.house why are allowing Tucker Carlson, an ideological white nationalist, in that community?
Good on ya for removing that shit and straight up laying out AMG here.
Removed by mod
Reposting removing explicit X hyperlinks:
Tucker Carlson has called out Ben Shapiro for cheering on the killing of Palestinian civilians, calling it evil, while Piers Morgan defended it (X link: SuppressedNws/status/1885475171667972426)
Tucker has gotten Matt Walsh to implicitly admit that Israel shouldn’t exist, because it depends on the US for its existence: (X link: abierkhatib/status/1917775533355720801)
Tucker is a member of the isolationist wing of Republicans trying to prevent war with Iran, and has called out “Mossad agents and warmongers” for derailing the talks: https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/trump-allies-say-mossad-agents-and-warmongers-trying-derail-iran-talks
Tucker hosted an interview with Thomas Massie where Massie revealed that every Republican Congressperson has an ‘AIPAC babysitter’ (X link: HotSpotHotSpot/status/1799169397510311993)
AIPAC is bipartisan, so I can be bipartisan too. I try to seek out and include conservative voices that are critical of Israel, and amplify the isolationist wing of the Republican party that opposes wars in the Middle East. I especially appreciate Tucker calling the killing of Palestinian civilians “evil”.
Make no mistake, Tucker Carlson is an antisemite and an islamaphobe. He is not anti-israel for any humanitarian reason, he only cynically uses anti-israel talking points to push antisemitic conspiracy theories. He does not care about Palestinians or any other Muslim or arab, he considers them primitives. He should not be platformed in any respect. There is plenty of genuine critisism of Israel that’s not based in antisemitic conspiracy theories, there is no need to promote Tucker Carlson is any respect.
Carlson called Iraqis “semiliterate primitive monkeys” in 2006 and argued that politicians should be more explicit about calling out “lunatic Muslims who are behaving like animals”.
https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/while-tucker-out-fox-networks-islamophobia-problem-persists
He went on to say that Afghanistan would never “be a civilized country because the people aren’t civilized.”
During his time at Fox, Carlson was the leading voice in right-wing media promoting the racist, anti-semitic, “great replacement” conspiracy theory. Carlson repeatedly warned viewers that Democrats were “importing” new citizens “to replace the disobedient ones.” Carlson once likened the Biden administration’s immigration policy to “eugenics” against white people.
The Fox host was a staunch opponent of the Black Lives Matter movement, and often invoked racist tropes and stereotypes to justify violence and discrimination against Black Americans. On June 3, 2020, Carlson centered his monologue around a montage of unarmed Black Americans who were killed by police, laying out his reasoning as to why each victim deserved to have been killed.
It’s true that Palestinian Christians are suffering, though it’s largely because they are Palestinians rather than because they are Christians. Carlson’s message, however, does less to draw attention to the plight of the Palestinians than to pit Jews against Christians. In trying to excommunicate Carlson, conservatives are pretending that he’s changed — but he’s really the same guy he always has been.
The antisemitic and otherwise bigoted things he said on Fox were far worse than anything in the Isaac interview and received only a fraction of the internal right-wing condemnation.
Carlson is exploiting legitimate criticism of Israel to fan the flames of Christian antisemitism, which has become a growing problem on the right even as much public attention recently has focused on the left wing.
https://www.vox.com/2024/4/16/24131384/tucker-carlson-interview-israel-palestine-munther-isaac
He is not anti-israel for any humanitarian reason, he only cynically uses anti-israel talking points to push antisemitic conspiracy theories.
I disagree. I think he’s sincere when he calls killing children evil, and that’s good. And I thought his interview with Munther Isaac was very important for breaking conservatives out of the “all Arabs are crazy Muslim and want to kill me” false belief, even if it did focus on the sufferings of the small minority of Palestinian Christians.
I don’t agree with everything he’s ever said or will say, he may say things I the future I have serious disagreements with. But I think the genocide in Gaza is the most pressing moral issue of our time, and am willing to build a big tent coalition to stop it and hold Israel responsible. I am also a big admirer of Hezbollah, who are very socially conservative, for what it’s worth.
Tucker Carlson fundamentally considers white people superior to non-white people. His grievance is that the fascism is being overseas when the US can instead use those resources to do so against the non-whites within America. Tucker is conservative on social issues because he is a supremacist for the white Christian race. He’s a domestic fascist, enthusiastic about mass deportations in the US.
This is completely separate from anti-colonialist resistance groups, who’s conservatism is a reaction to colonialism. These groups, while fundamentalist, are not fascist. ISIS would be an example of a fundamentalist and fascist group.
There is no ally-ship with fascists of any variety
Carlson is critical of Islam and has hosted guests on his program that criticize Islam.[433][434] He has described the existence of an “Islamic cult” and an “Islamic problem”, describing it as a threat to the United States.[433] He was critical of the Obama administration’s terrorism policy, arguing that it should have considered Islam as a cause of terrorism.
In 2018, Carlson described the effects of mass immigration on the United States using the terms dirtier, poorer, and more divided[435][436] and said it “has badly hurt this country’s natural landscape”.[437] On another 2018 episode, Carlson criticized multiculturalism in the United States, skeptically asking “how, precisely, is diversity our strength?” and whether any other institutions benefitted from a lack of commonalities.[438][439] Talking about Hazleton, Pennsylvania, where Hispanics had quickly become a majority of the population, Carlson said it was “more change than human beings are designed to digest”.[407] In May 2019 he said, “The flood of illegal workers into the United States has damaged our communities, ruined our schools, burdened our healthcare system and fractured our national unity.”[386] In December 2019, he falsely claimed that immigrants were responsible for making the Potomac River “dirtier and dirtier”.[440][441]
Didn’t get catch this gem lol
Also note the handle contains a notorious genocider Stalin
Hmm
Theres now zionists modding world news.
Now? Always?
They just shill DNC talking points and are part of the kamala’s camp.
It just so happens that Israel doing genocide is their shill talking points imho
It has been common knowledge around here to avoid news and politics communities on Lemmy.world due to heavy censorship to benefit US regime talking points.
You did your tour, you earned your ban, now seed smaller communities where freedom of speech and discussion is welcome.
Oh look it’s a PTB from PTB.world
You did nothing wrong. PTB
Goddamn it. This community is nothing but posts about the Israeli–Palestinian conflict, and it’s so fucking boring. Because you have the same users having the same fights in very post. RIP the Ye Power Trippin’ Bastards community.
Maybe if mods stopped censoring the people calling out genocide it would happen less.
But instead mods have to be Zionists.
Usual !world@lemmy.world move
Removed by mod
I would not scold people for figuring shit out as time goes on because that makes people dig in.
I have been calling .world mods of major subs for about a year once i noticed their censorship practices.
At first I was mocked, now this is common knowledge. Had similar issues with Europe sub hosted by german feddit. Same thing, now it is common knowledge.
Point being if you see misconduct, document it. If you are in fact right, time will prove it. Do as jesus would do in this situation, when they abuse you, give them the other cheek if you indeed believe in being right.
Fair points. Thank you.
Please stick to judgement as per the comm rules, and don’t start doing whatever that was. This is not the space to start slap-fights with other commenters.
That’s ml world news thoBoth. world news at lemmy ml is a shithole.
Everyone gets banned from .world eventually. Friend, consider it an honor. And welcome to the .world-banned club. You’ve got lots of company here! :)
When I got banned there, not only did they celebrate my banning, they actually wrote a special post about banning me in the c/politics community (it’s still there, people are free to look it up). All because I said I was gonna abandon the duopoly and vote third party.
And .worlders clapped and cheered the day I got banned, hoping that they had bullied me enough that I would leave Lemmy.
I’m still here. You will be too.
Brah, bail on .world now and find another instance to be your home. Because .worlders will start stalking you and serial downvoting you. You’ll be a lot happier on the cooler, less censorship-y instances.
PTB!
PTB. I read some of the comments and you are in the right imo (Even brought sources!). The other person was just both-siding the whole conflict and even went on some 4 comment long rant, thought at least they were banned.
I also found this comment; hilarious how they weren’t banned, but somehow you were lol
Love the promotions :) Oh and it’s !world@quokk.au without the ‘news’
Just checked that community; seems to be good. I’ve been avoiding world @ LW but this one seems interesting.
It’s the one I usually recommend on similar posts here
Fixed, thank you for the the correction!
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Well, there’s this quote from you
Oh, so genocide is ‘self defense.’ No, fuck off with that Zionist bullshit
Now, while I understand going hard on important topics, because there’s times I do itnmyself, it is definitely slap fight territory once you go there.
I agree with your stance, I even agree that it’s a topic worth fighting over.
But it definitely is slap fighting from that point in the thread downwards.
I want to side with you because I agree with what you said, but the only PTB part was it being a permanent ban. They do have a civility rule in place, so it isn’t like the action was taken in a vacuum. If the rule wasn’t there, it would be full PTB.
So, sorry, but this one is on you enough that it’s not PTB. I can’t say you deserved a permanent ban though, so it isn’t YDI either.
If that was the extent of my response, I’d say you have a point here. But that was in response to a multitude of disinformation used to blame the genocide and apartheid on the Palestinians, and I provided a multitude of sources to debunk those under that sentence.
I also didn’t even call the person I was replying to a Zionist there, despite it being true. I called the bullshit they were posting to be Zionist, because it was. I explicitly avoided what could be considered a personal attack, and instead attacked the substance of their comment as bullshit.
Was it as civil as I could possibly be? No, but even then I’d say it’s far more civil than any of those comments justifying genocide by blaming it on the victims, IMO
Yeah, but this community isn’t about being right or wrong on a topic. It’s about mod decisions.
As such, if there’s a rule in place, and the user breaks it, it’s kinda on them unless the rule is egregiously out of line in the first place. We’re all expected to check the rules of a community before jumping in and commenting. That’s just how forums work.
Once you crossed over that line, you put the issue into someone else’s judgement as to whether or not to take action. It doesn’t matter if you’re right or wrong, or what the topic is. What matters is whether or not you broke community rules, and whether or not the mod took appropriate action.
See, that’s what I think people miss. This community here isn’t just a place to vent about mod actions. It also serves as a place to crowd source best practices, and as a form of “AITA” as part of that crowd sourcing.
If you come here with the expectation that the subject of the comment or post is the most important factor, you’re going to be disappointed. In this case, I already said I agreed with your stance, but your stance simply doesn’t matter in terms of what this community does. You could have been arguing the exact opposite stance, and it wouldn’t change whether or not you broke a rule there, and thus is irrelevant to whether or not the mod action was appropriate or not.
And, hell, I even said it was over the line for a single event as far as that goes. Should have been either a direct warning that you were crossing rules, or a temporary, short ban to give a cooldown period
Any time a civility rule exists, there is only one answer to who decides what is and isn’t civil discourse. The mods make that decision. They can be disagreed with, obviously. But if we as users behave in a way that makes them make a judgement call, it isn’t always going to be the call we would prefer. And you did engage in behavior that can be easily interpreted as uncivil. It’s our, your responsibility to check in with mods before going off if you care about the possible consequences.
You did and said what you felt was necessary. That’s a good thing. Sometimes fighting the good fight has unpleasant outcomes. You walk up and punch a literal Nazi, that’s a good thing but you still committed battery. So you have to accept that there may be consequences despite having the moral high ground.
I disagree that it violated community guidelines, as per Rule 5 I did not attack the person, but the substance of the disinformation. Use of strong language is allowed per that rule as long as it’s not directed at a person which I didn’t, it was directed at the disinformation.
I don’t think it’s reasonable for me to need to check in with a mod before I respond to Zionist disinformation on world@world.news, there is way too much allowed that go unchecked by the mods themselves.
If a mod was concerned I was crossing a line and messaged me about it, I would’ve complied. I certainly agree with you about what the mod action should have been if there was concern about civility.
JordanLund has already defended the suppression of Palestinian emancipatory slogans in the past. I can’t say I’m too surprised by his actions here with that in mind.
I definitely agree with your last paragraph. If that communities’ mods would prefer to provide a safe space liberal Zionist propaganda because they perceive it as civil, that’s their decision. I have no regrets about my comments on that thread.
I mean, obviously you disagree, or you wouldn’t be here
All I’m saying is that telling someone to “fuck off with that shit” is going to draw mod attention when there’s a civility rule in place. There’s pretty much nowhere on earth that telling someone to fuck off with that shit is considered friendly.
Yes, there are times it’s justified, but pretending that it isn’t also uncivil is sophistry at best. It doesn’t even matter if someone else starts it, once a slap fight is on, it’s on and anyone joining in is contributing to the problem.
Did you report the other user’s comments? Because that’s the first step we’re supposed to take. Then the second is walking away. Now, again, I agree that sometimes you can’t just walk away. If you scroll back far enough in my user history, you’ll find a recent-ish situation where I tore into a transphobic asshole and was even less civil than anything you said.
I wasn’t walking away, and I was definitely justified. But I’m not going to pretend I wasn’t breaking a civility rule in the process, and if I’d gotten banned, I’d have been just fine with it because sometimes that’s the price you pay. You accept that as part and parcel of protest and resistance because that’s how it works. Hell, it’s part of the point. If you can’t take the heat of your own choices, you’re making bad choices.
Well said.
Jordan Lund once said biden just had to send those bombs to defend America against iran
Jordan Lund is the quintessential PTB.
JodanLund is a reddit mod incarnate.
Privileged white dude who acts like he’s some progressive, but actually hates Black people standing up, and vaguely supports things when it becomes popular enough.
I remember when he was pro-genocde and now he pretends he’s against what’s happening Gaza. Still will ban you for giving citations that prove him wrong from places that the .world bot says are fine.
At least .ml is open in what they support and remove. .world pretends to be a neutral arbiter while censoring anything they don’t like.
yeah he really sucks. He does a good job hiding it. If you look at his comment stream its pretty benign, then he goes way off occassionally. Later you look back at his comments and its all cleaned up/deleted like it never happened. He knows exactly what he is doing.
You also aren’t allowed to point out Harris was okay with Bidens Gaza plans.
Or use anything that has substack in the footer simply because that makes it a blog, see dropsitenews.com
Pointing out that Harris was comfortable with Israel’s/Biden’s genocide in Gaza is objectively worse than mass murder, don’t’cha know? Murder is overseas, I can ignore it, therefore its not worth my time. But criticizing people? That’s plain evil and you must be banned. /s
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At least .ml is open in what they support and remove. .world pretends to be a neutral arbiter while censoring anything they don’t like.
Yep!
lemmy.world has been taken over by right wing mods, do with that info what you will
Taken over? Always has been.
Calling them right wing ain’t right unless you consider DNC a right wing order tbh
They deff shill US centric regime talking points
I do indeed consider the DNC to be center right
You don’t?
They crush progressives while giving them lip service, and cater to corporate interests almost as much as the repugincans
Just that with the DNC they most likely won’t violate the constitution
One is rusty shitbox, the other is radioactive rusty shitbox that is also on fire
In those circumstances, I choose rusty shitbox every time
And the right wing mods I’m talking about are hard right pretending not to be but their modlog patterns give em away
By DNC do you mean US democratic party? They are centre-right.
Correct and they are, but Americans LARP it as the “left”
Yeah, I know, you have two parties: one centre-right and one far right with straight nazi nutjobs.
Edit: what I meant lemmy.world mods may actually be right wing. You have seen the guy banning me and keeping all the posts by a genocide apologist.
I don’t think them banning you for this makes them right wing in the us context aka RNC whores
Mods on lemmy.world are DNC acolytes. I have never seen them rep anything that would make them appear to shill RNC talking points.
I think you misunderstood me, I meant they may be right wing as in US Democrats are right wing.
The guy banning me was the most definitely trying to push pro-Israel narrative by doing that so it fits within right wing set of views.
OK that’s tracks… But from American perspective these are the “liberals” 🤣
Fml
The White liberal is the worst enemy to America and the worst enemy to the Black man. Let me first explain what I mean by this White liberal. In America there’s no such thing as Democrats and Republicans anymore. That’s antiquated. In America you have liberals and conservatives. This is what the American political structure boils down to among Whites.
Malcolm X covered this issue properly 2 generations ago and yet still here we be 🤡
They aren’t right-wing. They’re pro-Duopoly. They don’t like anything, left or right, that may shake people up enough to talk about starting/supporting/voting Third Party.
Ah 2 new communities to block. Thanks mate.
